Ειδικότητα στην Μεγάλη Βρετανία

[Sovereign]

PS1. One can avoid sounding like a 70y old granny from the north by not referring to others as ‘dear’.

If you're referring to the North of England, we tend to prefer "luv", "mate", "chicken" and "duck".

"Dear" is a bit too posh for us northerners

[Wicked Witch]

[quote name='marouska' date='30 November 2009 - 12:34 PM' timestamp='1259584320'

Μιλάω για το ποια χαρτιά χρειάζονται κτλ...

Τεσπα.

Τροποποιήθηκε 30 Νοεμβρίου 2009 από Wicked Witch

[Cadaver]

Nothing beats being greeted from the other end of the ward at 06:00 by your morbidly obese Jamaican staff nurse with "mooooorniiin baaabyyyy"

This translates to "mooooooorninnnn giiiirlfrieeeeeendd" for my female colleagues.

Quality time.-

[Sovereign]

Και οι άλλοι κάθονται και τσακώνονται για το αν προκόβουν οι Έλληνες στο εξωτερικό.

Ο Cadaver πάντως πρόκοψε!

[Wicked Witch]

What’s the difference between an:

Academic Clinical Fellow,

and an:

Academic Clinical Lecturer ?!

How do these titles fit in with run-through training?

What’s an ‘academic CT1’? Can you not go into academic medicine if you have not started as an academic CT1?!

…Sov?

[skaliotis]

What’s the difference between an:

Academic Clinical Fellow,

and an:

Academic Clinical Lecturer ?!

How do these titles fit in with run-through training?

What’s an ‘academic CT1’? Can you not go into academic medicine if you have not started as an academic CT1?!

…Sov?

I could be wrong and I probably am but here goes:

Academic clinical fellow is someone taking time out of the training scheme to do research, MD, PhD

Academic Clinical Lecturer is someone with CCT and a postgraduate degree who has some clinical duties at consultant level but also is an academic involved in research and teaching. Sometimes would have the title of Honorary Consultant as well

You can also enter academic medicine at "registrar" level, for instance Academic ST4 in psychiatry,though not common is out there

[pas moi]

What’s the difference between an:

Academic Clinical Fellow,

and an:

Academic Clinical Lecturer ?!

How do these titles fit in with run-through training?

What’s an ‘academic CT1’? Can you not go into academic medicine if you have not started as an academic CT1?!

…Sov?

You can get into academic medicine even if you have not done an academic FY1/FY2/CT1/CT2 etc... Having done one will surely help, as it's an easy way to prove that you've got the research bug in you. You almost certainly have something to publish/present at the end of such a rotation and therefore you can tick the right boxes in the application form.

Now, there are programmes where ACFs in a specific specialty are advertised and in essence they are run-through programmes (e.g. in the W Midlands) in that specialty-so basically you get a NTN from CT1 - on the condition that you pass membership exams by the end of CT2. From my experience, these posts are usually offered to internal candidates... They don't want to risk giving a NTN to a CT1 who may not be that interested in that specialty afterall (and for many other reasons).

What an academic CT1 post involves depends on the programme and the deanery. Thus, it would be useful to read the job description for the ones you are interested Usually, a combination of original research and clinical work The order and the proportion of each varies with each programme. Also, these usually lead to a postgraduate degree but that again depends on the programme and what results and grants you get.

I assume you know about this My link website right?

Fellows are a step lower to lecturers in the academic ladder.

If I were you and I was not intending to go back to Greece in the near future to complete my training, I would certainly apply for an academic post. It's the "easy" way to get a very competitive NTN. The deadline for this year's ACFs is coming Friday 4/12/09.

I hope this helps.

[anspan]

Γεια σας παιδιά κι από εμένα!! Καταρχήν να ευχαριστήσω ειλικρινά όλους εσάς που μας δίνετε τόσες πολλές και χρήσιμες πληροφορίες σχετικά με την ειδικότητα στην Αγγλία. Σκέφτομαι κι εγώ με τη σειρά μου να ανηφορίσω στο νησί, θα ήθελα όμως πρώτα να σας ρωτήσω κάτι κι όποιος ξέρει μπορεί να μου απαντήσει. Γνωρίζει κανένας σας τι παίζει με την ειδικότητα στην Ιρλανδία ? Από άποψη ποιότητας εκπαίδευσης, παροχών, κόστους διαβίωσης κτλ κτλ. Από λίγο που έχω ψάξει, έχω βρει ότι η διαδικασία εισαγωγής για νέους γιατρούς είναι πολύ μεθοδευμένη και συγκεκριμένη κι η ιστοσελίδα τους τουλάχιστον καθορίζει με σαφήνεια τα βήματα που πρέπει να κάνεις.

(βέβαια έχω διληματιστεί λίγο με το internship. Ξέρω ότι είναι τα δικά μας εξάμηνα, αλλά δεν έχω πάρει τέτοιο χαρτί απτη σχολή και δεν ξέρω αν δίνουν κάτι τέτοιο κι ακόμη κι αν δίνουν, αν θα μου το αναγνωρίσουν εκεί.Κι έπειτα σκέφτομαι αν υπάρξει δυνατότητα, μήπως να αρχίσει κανείς από internship για να μπει καλύτερα στο σύστημά τους).

Επίσης αντί για τα 3 στάδια του MRCP έχουν 2 αντίστοιχα στάδια και σε μερικά άλλα site που διάβασα έχουν πολύ καλές παροχές γενικότερα.

Περισσότερα δεν γνωρίζω...Αν δηλαδή έχουν το ίδιο σύστημα ειδίκευσης με CT και ST, αν τις θέσεις τους τις χτυπάνε οι Βρετανοί, αν υπάρχει δυνατότητα μεταπήδησης από τη μία χώρα στην άλλη και γενικότερα αν αξίζει μια προσπάθεια προς τα εκεί δεδομένου ότι και μικρότερη χώρα είναι και ενδεχομένως λιγότερες δυνατότητες να σου προσφέρει, σε όλους τους τομείς. Άλλο Λονδίνο κι άλλο Δουβλίνο...Όχι οτι θα πάω στο Λονδίνο αλλά τέλος πάντων. Τουλάχιστον 3-4 μέρες άδεια, ΟΠΟΤΕ τις πάρεις, να ξέρεις ότι έχεις και κάποιες εναλλακτικές...

Θα εκτιμούσα ιδιαίτερα αν κάποιος με προσωπική εμπειρία μπορούσε να μου απαντήσει. Και καλή σταδιοδρομία σε όλους !

[Wicked Witch]

Thanks guys:)

Thanks to you its all a bit clearer now though, feels like the pieces of the puzzle are falling into place.

I've seen the website 'pas moi'...and I didn't like it.Gimme a flowchart darn it!

Τροποποιήθηκε 2 Δεκεμβρίου 2009 από Wicked Witch

[7nt.army]

(ειλικρινά διάβασα αρκετές σελίδες,αλλά αυτό που ήθελα δεν το βρήκα,έτσι ρωτώ κι όποιος είναι πρόθυμος ας απαντήσει

πόσο σημασία έχει να έχεις περάσει το MRCP1,στοχεύοντας σε CTS?

πόσο εύκολο είναι το CT για Καρδιολογία,γενικά,και

πόσο εύκολο με κλινικη εμπειρία 2χρόνια Παθολογίας και 2 καρδιολογίας στην Ελλάδα+MRCP1.Και τέλος,

ποιος ξέρει αν 2 χρόνια CT(που αναγωρίζονται στην Ελλάδα,και άρα αρκούν για πλήρη ειδικότητα)είναι εκπαίδευση επιπέδου ειδικού καρδιολόγου,ώστε εαν δεν επιθυμώ να συνεχίσω ΝΑ ΞΕΡΩ ΟΤΙ ΔΕΝ ΕΧΑΣΑ ΤΟ ΧΡΟΝΟ ΜΟΥ ΣΤΟ ΝΗΣΙ???

[trivialx]

What’s the difference between an:

Academic Clinical Fellow,

and an:

Academic Clinical Lecturer ?!

How do these titles fit in with run-through training?

What’s an ‘academic CT1’? Can you not go into academic medicine if you have not started as an academic CT1?!

…Sov?

Academic clinical fellow gets an academic training number, continues the run-through training although in a slower pace. These posts are usually for 3 years and typically include (for a period of one year) 9 months of wards and 3 months of research. However, various combinations exist. Candidates should be in the registrar level.

Guidelines mention that people applying should aim for a higher degree but in reality (London), you get a position only with a higher degree, publications and the rest of the package that gives you the 'x' factor (congratulations Joe!).

Academic clinical fellow and clinical research fellow are not the same.

Academic clinical lecturer is a level up from the academic clinical fellow and typically these posts are created on a basis of external funding from research grants. Working package varies. Consultant level is desirable but not essential. Consultant level is essential only for senior clinical lecturer and higher academic grades.

Finally, you can go to academic medicine without starting from an academic CT1.

[pas moi]

πόσο σημασία έχει να έχεις περάσει το MRCP1,στοχεύοντας σε CTS?

I assume you mean a CT post in cardiology i.e CT3 and above. Based on this assumption: There is no-way that you get such a post without full membership (Part 1, 2 and PACES). Also from August 2011 you cannot get in any medical specialty without full membership. Therefore everyone will have completed MRCP (probably by Oct the year before) which means other achievements will count towards someone getting a specialty job. This is what happens now anyway but it is not a formal requirement.

πόσο εύκολο είναι το CT για Καρδιολογία,γενικά

Very difficult but not impossible with papers, courses, audits, presentations, knowing one of the Consultants in the panel or someone who knows you knowing the Consultant in the panel etc

πόσο εύκολο με κλινικη εμπειρία 2χρόνια Παθολογίας και 2 καρδιολογίας στην Ελλάδα+MRCP1.

As above

Και τέλος,ποιος ξέρει αν 2 χρόνια CT(που αναγωρίζονται στην Ελλάδα,και άρα αρκούν για πλήρη ειδικότητα)είναι εκπαίδευση επιπέδου ειδικού καρδιολόγου,ώστε εαν δεν επιθυμώ να συνεχίσω ΝΑ ΞΕΡΩ ΟΤΙ ΔΕΝ ΕΧΑΣΑ ΤΟ ΧΡΟΝΟ ΜΟΥ ΣΤΟ ΝΗΣΙ???

Well, I assume that this depends on what the alternative is... i.e. what you'ld be doing if you were not going to the UK. Also it depends on where in the UK you spend these 2 years and where you'ld spend them in Greece...

Disclaimer: I am not a Cardiology trainee.

No greek fonts @work.

Τροποποιήθηκε 14 Δεκεμβρίου 2009 από pas moi

[CHRISTARAS]

It would be very nice if someone could sum up and explain the basic steps for medical specialty in UK .With too much replies i consider that it is quite diffucult for someone to understand the whole process. I believe that it would be very useful.

thanks

[TheConjurer]

Did you proof read your ramblings before you posted? Are you having trouble studying for the USMLE due to language...difficulties?You'll still need to pass IELTS if you're hoping to cum up here:)

PS.Someone already has.Try using the search function once in a while.

Τροποποιήθηκε 28 Δεκεμβρίου 2009 από TheConjurer

[ppalios]

Did you proof read your ramblings before you posted? Are you having trouble studying for the USMLE due to language...difficulties?You'll still need to pass IELTS if you're hoping to cum up here

Ρε, μας δουλεύετε χρονιάρες μέρες?

[MoNkEy mAn]

in order to "cum" there, he will only need to find a "partner"

Τροποποιήθηκε 31 Δεκεμβρίου 2009 από MoNkEy mAn

[pas moi]

in order to "cum" there, he will only need to find a "partner"

A partner.... no need for quotation marks

[TheConjurer]

My sense of humor getting too ...raunchy for you?

I hate to be the one to break it to you, but you don't necessarily need a partner other than yourself in order to c*m. Imagine what you've been missing all these years...

Τροποποιήθηκε 6 Ιανουαρίου 2010 από TheConjurer

[koufos1]

θα ηθελα μια συμβουλη ή εστω μια αποψη ατομων που κανουν ή εκαναν ειδικοτητα ΜΒ

κανω ειδικοτητα παθολογιας,σκεφτομαι να συμπληρωσω 2 χρονια και να κανω τη προσπαθεια για το νησι

τι θα προτεινατε να κανω για να αυξησω τις πιθανοτητες για να βρω θεση st? σε ειδικοτητα πνευμονολογια ,γαστρεντερολογια

να αρχισω fy2?? ή να βρω καποιον Ελληνα καθηγητη να αρχισω αττατσμεντ??καποια αλλη εισηγηση?

ευχαριστω εκ των προτερων

[Wicked Witch]

'There is no such thing as a ‘cardiology core medical training’ ...Cardiology (-ology specialty posts in general) are only found at post-general module level=the ancient registrar years'= post RC exams-->more info on medical training structure here:http://www.greekmeds.gr/forum/index.php?showtopic=5844&st=1280&p=261878&#entry261878

If you are..

1.hoping to complete/continue your training in the UK in any -ology:you have missed the boat. Even with 2 years of 'Pathollogia' in greece there is no way you'll get an ST3 job (for many reasons).

2.hoping to work for a couple of years and then go back, get your time in the UK recognized as training, and continue in greece (note that this would only work if you are aiming for a specialization in internal medicine).:you're in luck!With the right preparation you may be able to get a 'Core Medical Training ' job, or, 'trust'/'staff grade' for the more adventurous types.

3.a restless soul who enjoys traveling : as per #2.

You would probably be vastly overqualified to apply for FY2, plus why would you risk it being stuck working in 4 specialties you have absolutely no interest in?

An attachment is always a good idea if you can find someone to take you on.

Τροποποιήθηκε 8 Ιανουαρίου 2010 από Wicked Witch

[CHRISTARAS]

Did you proof read your ramblings before you posted? Are you having trouble studying for the USMLE due to language...difficulties?You'll still need to pass IELTS if you're hoping to cum up here:)

PS.Someone already has.Try using the search function once in a while.

Παιδι μου conjurer cum που θες για να στρωσεις εσυ...ολοι μαζι

[Holly]

Γειά σας!

Απο μια ημερίδα μπορώ να ανεβάσω αυτό το χαρτί. Τα επεξηγεί πολυ καλά!

ΕΠΕΞΗΓΗΣΗ ΤΟΥ ΣΥΣΤΗΜΑΤΟΣ MMC - AGGLIKO INTITOUTO.doc

Τροποποιήθηκε 11 Ιανουαρίου 2010 από Holly

[Holly]

και μιας και τα κατάφερα με το ανέβασμα αρχείων, ορίστε και τα υπόλοιπα doc.

Είναι απο την ημερίδα της Helmsic ---> http://athens.helmsic.gr/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=62&Itemid=115

MEDICAL_SPECIALTY_SERVICES_-_EducationUK - AGGLIKO INSTITOUTO.doc

MED_PROF_QUAL_WWW - AGGLIKO INSTITOUTO.doc

[pas moi]

θα ηθελα μια συμβουλη ή εστω μια αποψη ατομων που κανουν ή εκαναν ειδικοτητα ΜΒ

κανω ειδικοτητα παθολογιας,σκεφτομαι να συμπληρωσω 2 χρονια και να κανω τη προσπαθεια για το νησι

τι θα προτεινατε να κανω για να αυξησω τις πιθανοτητες για να βρω θεση st? σε ειδικοτητα πνευμονολογια ,γαστρεντερολογια

να αρχισω fy2?? ή να βρω καποιον Ελληνα καθηγητη να αρχισω αττατσμεντ??καποια αλλη εισηγηση?

ευχαριστω εκ των προτερων

A quickie to say:

It depends whether you'ld rather specialise in Greece or in the UK.

If it's the latter then you'ld be overqualified for a FY2 post. Aim for a stand alone CT2 post if you can or even for CT3 in Resp Medicine if you have MRCP part 1. Over the last 2 years it was one of the least competitive specialties offering places even to those having just Part 1, let alone anything else. Gastro is competitive.

Whatever level you want to enter you will need to demonstrate that you are competent in a number of skills for the level below that (based on the curriculum for each level i.e. FY1/2, CT1 etc). I'm not so sure how you can do that when you come from abroad.

Applying for CT3 posts, at least in medicine, will start soon(ish). I think it's early Feb but don't quote me.

If you want to return to Greece to complete your training, but want to gain some experience abroad prior to that, then you could apply for a Trust Grade post. Good money, not so much training (although that depends where you are...) and not too much of a competition to get such a job. It may even be recognised as part of the training in Greece-not so sure about that though.

No need to do an attachment. Two years of internal medicine sounds good and will look good if you can demonstrate the relevant competencies. I'm sure you'll find somewhere in the UK to work and get paid for it (I bet my house on this). Whether it's a good move or not it all depends on what you want to get out of this and what the alternative is.

I hope I've helped, even a wee bit. Good luck.

Τροποποιήθηκε 12 Ιανουαρίου 2010 από pas moi

[anypomonos]

Good evening,

As i am in a similar condition, i am going to begin the first two years of internal medicine here and then i would like to try to continue in UK, i fully understand the reasons that would led to my possible failure of being accepted in ST1 posts...

That's why, i would be interested to learn what would be the better solution in this case: to complete the two-year course of internal medicine in Greece and apply for CT2 in UK (that means repeat CT2: would i be considered overqualified?) or complete 1st year of internal medicine here and then apply for CT2 in UK? would i have more chances to be accepted in CT2 or is it difficult too? would an MRCP1 or 2 guarantee my acceptance at this level?

Thanks in advance,

Giannis

Τροποποιήθηκε 12 Ιανουαρίου 2010 από anypomonos